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Frankl
Tinkerer
Username: Frankl
Post Number: 8
Registered: 09-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, October 14, 2007 - 05:25 am: | 
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I am interested in trying my hand at medium format and would like any advice on a "reasonable" choice of cameras. I am partial to a fold out type and have several of the 616 variety but, as you know, the film is impossible to find and/or very difficult to improvise. I would like to find a 120 type but could probably get by with a 620 (and re-spool 120 film??). The really hard part is the I really don't want to "spring" for an Ikonta or Bessa II  .... Any advice will certaily be taken with an open mind though. Thank you all....
Frank. |
F16sunshyn
Tinkerer
Username: F16sunshyn
Post Number: 22
Registered: 05-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, October 14, 2007 - 06:54 pm: |
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I think others will agree. A twin lens reflex is a great way to get into MF. There are many great choice that won't break the bank. Repairs are simple and inexpensive. I started with a TLR (Yashica 124). Still today I use the camera to shoot IR film. The scheme of viewing thrue one lens and taking with the other, is perfect when you have a heavy filter on. It is also nice for portraits and candid shots, subjects act more naturally when you don't have the camera at your face. I guess my point is. Even when you are ready to expand to a more complex system. The TLR will be there for it's strong suits. |
Rj_
Tinkerer
Username: Rj_
Post Number: 54
Registered: 08-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, October 15, 2007 - 03:42 pm: |
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" The really hard part is the I really don't want to "spring" for an Ikonta or Bessa II :-( "
Hi Frankl,
this is no worry at all. The 120 roll format vintage folding camera comes in a variety of makes. It seems that the German versions were overemphasised by collectors, however their lenses and designs were equalled by many foreign manufacturers.
The famous Ross (Houghton, as well as Ross Ensign) company manufactured a series of 6x4.5, 6x6 & 6x9cm vintage folders with the legendary Ross Xpres lens. Having used a Voigtlander Heliar 10cm f4.5, I find the Ross Xpres lens is superior in contrast and definition with a character of its own. Some of the Ross folders reach unassailable collector's prices, however generally a Ross Ensign Selfix Special (shoots 6x9cm & 6x6cm) with a Ross Xpres f3.8 105mm lens, or a Ross Selfix 6x6cm camera with a 75mm f3.5 Ross Xpres lens is a great start. The shutters tend to need attention prior to considering due to its Epsilon design.
On the cheaper scale, a Russian Iskra or similar 6x9cm/6x6cm folder would offer a budget entry. The disadvantage of the Russian folders is that the build quality is inferior to the Ross Ensigns in material, design and lens calibre.
Alternatively, there were a number of American companies with folding cameras. The German camera manufacturer, Agfa, marketed a series of 6x6cm folders with various grades of lenses, however none of the Agfa Isolettes have the same quality of build as a Zeiss Ikonta or a Ross Ikonta. Balda of Germany also marketed 6x6cm folding cameras with stunning designs and very good lenses. Some of their lenses were triplets, with interesting characteristics; others were less spectacular Tessar type lenses.
And as F16sunshyn suggests, the field of the TLR is equally rich; the Japanese marketed the Minolta Autocord, the Ricoh Diacord too; the English marketed the MPP Microcord & Microflex along with various generations of Rolleiflexes.
I would agree with you that a 120 roll vintage folder makes more sense, due to the film compatibility issue. Dan Fromm (www.graflex.org) might be able to help you with a conversion for 620 roll holders to accept 120 roll film. The forum is for Graflex users, which although are technically press cameras, also have bellows, and are also vintage.
Kind regards,
RJ |
Dgillette4
Tinkerer
Username: Dgillette4
Post Number: 98
Registered: 04-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, October 15, 2007 - 03:59 pm: |
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Hi Frank: Medium format is great and even better when you print your own negs. If you are on a tight budget like me you might consider a used tlr, such as Yahica mat or if a slr bronica has the etr bodies and lenses very reasonable, If you are interested in rf cameras there are many used russian ones out there on the web. You didn't mention how much you wanted to spend. I have many nice 16x20s from a Yashica mat 124 Yashinon lens very good. Don |
Adrian
Tinkerer
Username: Adrian
Post Number: 94
Registered: 08-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, October 16, 2007 - 08:05 am: |
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If you are dipping your toe into the MF water, you could always play with something a bit old and clunky for a few dollars first, while you decide whether you like it or not.
I started with box cameras - there is no need to be quite such a reactionary old fart as that, but if you are just experimenting I see no reason why you shouldn't find an old Kodak (pre-1930s, the bellows seem to last and last. 1930s bellows disintegrate... And as for 620...). I'd guess, not being in the USA, that Ansco Isolettes are fairly cheap, especially with the bottom-of-the-range Agnar lens...
You get the picture - be brave, try something for a giggle while you look for the better camera you really want. I ended up with a Voigtlander Vito (OK, 35mm but you get the idea) and a Moskva 4, but I still get the old Brownies out every once in a while.
Whatever you end up doing, have fun!
Adrian |
Leesobing
Tinkerer
Username: Leesobing
Post Number: 15
Registered: 01-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 18, 2009 - 01:41 am: |
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for TLR why not segull4A 109 this is new even decreasing production.
segull TLR have over 40 year .It is said than using east gemany lens in early.the coating is light orgnae colour.
It has 4A,4B,4b1and 4c
4b is flog glass for viewfinder,4B1 http://www.photosig.com/articles/773/article |
Alex
Tinkerer
Username: Alex
Post Number: 76
Registered: 07-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 18, 2009 - 04:39 am: |
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Lots of good advice here. The Zeiss build does tend to be better than the Agfa, but a serviceable Agfa is no slouch, especially if it has been properly refurbished. You could do a lot worse than picking up a Zeiss Nettar with Novar lens. People are enthusiastic, justifiably, about the Tessar-equipped models, but the Novar is a little star, often under-rated, and with a little stopping down, which you'd probably do anyway, it'll match the Tessar. Only for much less. I also have a little Ikonta A, which is a little peach. It takes 120, and gives sixteen 4.5x6 frames.
Some say that the Agfa bellows invariably have light leaks. I've been rather luckier in my experience. I have three Isolettes, two with Solinars, one with the Apotar. All three are light-tight. One of the Solinar cameras is a Kreckel refurb, with the bellows replaced by a fetching red set. It takes fantastic pictures.
I take these out more than I take out a TLR, mostly because a good folder is just so much more portable. But my TLR is a Yashica-12, an earlier version of the 124/124G. The differences are just cosmetic, the lens and shutter is the same, and the 12 doesn't take the 220 film that the 124 and 24 models can. The Yashica-12 can be had for a fraction of the price a 124G fetches, and it's a more rugged build. As it happens, I got mine for nothing at all ; it belonged to my sister-in-law's Uncle Bill, a seafaring man who took it all around the world, and it was given to me after Uncle Bill passed away, as someone who'd use it rather than sell it. Smart woman, is Pam.
Don't dismiss Adrian's box camera suggestion as too tongue-in-cheek. I have much fun with a No.2 Box Brownie, Model F, of which I've two, one with the portrait lens flip-out. These models take 120 film, not the later 620, so re-spooling is not a problem. I've also a couple of Zeiss Box Tengors, and they produce surprisingly sharp images. Or maybe not so surprisingly, given the pedigree.
Here's another advantage of a box camera. It's impossible for people to see you using it, without smiling. |
Barnum
Tinkerer
Username: Barnum
Post Number: 93
Registered: 10-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 18, 2009 - 12:46 pm: |
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Hi!
I have a spare Franka Solida 3. Lens is pretty fast for the time, being F2.9. Built-in rangefinder. Uses 120. It's for sale, or WHY? |
Paul_ron
Tinkerer
Username: Paul_ron
Post Number: 140
Registered: 07-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 18, 2009 - 08:00 pm: |
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I'll tell ya for less than $100 bucks the Yashicamats are pretty hard to beat. I have a nice collection with a good representation of almost teh entire line n every one of em takes beautiful pictures.
OTOH... why not keep a sharp eye on the classifieds n get yourself a nice 645 SLR MF like a Bronica ETR or ETRS for about $200? THese cameras are little bull dogs built tough. They handel well for street n are pretty as studio cameras. Leaf shuters are electronically controled but are the primative electronics that live forever because they were so overbuilt.
Now for a real bargain in SLRs these days are the RB67s. You can find em dirt cheap considering what these cameras were in their day. Russian tanks that will out live all of us. Yes they are big n heavy but the glass is superb, the quality of the build is amazing as you'll notice as soon as you pick one up.
So spend your money on a Seagul toy or just make the jump into the cold water? You'll find it was worth the little bit more to get a real camera. Buy it once n if you don't like it, sell it for what you paid? I am sure someone else will snap it right up.
Regardless of what camera you buy, they are all old n will need some attention. Seals mainly and that is a small DIY job that I am sure will wet your whistle n get you hooked on these cameras like heroine. You'll be spending your lunch money on these in no time at all.
But seriously, do some serious shoping n price comparrison. Check PhotoNet's classifieds as I ahve found many good bargains there n I have never been stiffed with junk. The people there are very honest.
Other photo forums have great deals as well in their classfieds. Keep shopping till you find the one that has your name on it.
I am sure we all have a few extra camera in the closet we'd be willing to sell if you are really interested. |
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