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Pcollins
Tinkerer
Username: Pcollins
Post Number: 1
Registered: 10-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, October 17, 2009 - 08:21 am: | 
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Hi all,
I have found tons of useful information on here about repairing my recently acquired Konica Auto S2. It came to me nearly fully functioning with the major exception of the aperture blades and the loose mirror in the rangefinder portion. The shutter was almost fully operational but was a bit sticky at the higher speeds.
My major issue right now is the self timer. It was functioning fine but I did something in the testing of the camera that has caused it to jam. I don't believe it is an issue of cleaning the self timer to un-jam it, it is definitely something that I have done to jam it. The film advance lever does not advance the film (it did before) and the shutter release button depresses but does not activate the shutter. Currently the self timer is activated but not timing or releasing and the shutter blades are in the closed position.
I have been able to progress far enough in the repair that I have the front element and the wavy retaining ring off the lens so I can see the self timer etc. with the cam ring removed. I have a feeling that if I could just release the self timer I could proceed with clean/lube the shutter blades and aperture blades to restore the camera to working condition.
Your help is greatly appreciated. There seem to be a lot of helpful people on the forum and I have searched the archives but most of the repair to self timer is cleaning oriented, this is clearly jammed somehow. |
Scott
Tinkerer
Username: Scott
Post Number: 50
Registered: 07-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, October 17, 2009 - 09:50 am: |
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It's been a few years since I saw the insides of my S2.
As I'm sure you know, if the self-timer is keeping the cocked shutter from releasing/firing, then that's why the the advance lever won't move.
If you've got the shutter open, here's what I would try: Hopefully, the self-timer is not fully cocked. Put 4-5 drops of naptha directly into the gears of the ST mechanism, and wiggle the ST lever juuust a little. back and forth, but mostly in the cocking direction, and without cocking the pawl any further. That might allow the spring to fully unwind the mechanism.
If it is hopelessly jammed, then I think the ST can be removed as a unit by removing a clip and a couple of screws, and I don't think removing it will affect the function of the shutter (except maybe the M-sync). |
Nickon51
Tinkerer
Username: Nickon51
Post Number: 101
Registered: 05-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 12:56 am: |
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Self timers are a common problem in jamming up shutters, the small gears in them get gummy and stuck more quickly than the rest of the shutter.
The Self timer in the Auto S2 is pevented from operating when the flash delay is set from X to M. If this lever was actuated while the self timer was cocked it may have stopped it. There is also a lever on the inside edge of the barrel about halfway down the selftimer escapement, but I can't remember off hand what activated it.
The self timer is easy to remove as a complete module. Just remove the circlip from the post and slacken the screw and lift it out.
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Pcollins
Tinkerer
Username: Pcollins
Post Number: 2
Registered: 10-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 04:33 am: |
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Thanks for the replies so far, very helpful.
I have made some progress in that I was able to depress a lever-I think the one that you marked that stops the self timer-and that ran the self timer. It did it's thing but the shutter remains in the closed position. The film advance lever is still not doing what it's supposed to do but the shutter button feels normal now.
So I now have a working self timer, shutter in the closed position, film advance lever not working. If there were just a way I could get the shutter activated and get to the aperture blades I could clean them and I think i would be on my way.
What could be the problem or what should my next step be? Is it a matter of removing the top?
Thanks all for your help. |
Nickon51
Tinkerer
Username: Nickon51
Post Number: 102
Registered: 05-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 07:10 am: |
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The blades will be closed whether the shutter is cocked or uncocked. The only way they will stay open for you to reach the aperture blades is to put the shutter into B and hold the release down.
As far as the advance goes, check that the shutter has been fired. The arrow points to the shutter release. Push that inwards towards to centre.
If that releases the wind lever you should be able to wind on, set the shutter to B and fire. |
Pcollins
Tinkerer
Username: Pcollins
Post Number: 3
Registered: 10-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 01:13 pm: |
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It's going well... :D
I pushed the indicated part towards the centre but that didn't change anything with the wind lever.
When I have the lens in the disassembled state how do I set the shutter speed to B?
As always, your help is appreciated. |
Nickon51
Tinkerer
Username: Nickon51
Post Number: 104
Registered: 05-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, October 21, 2009 - 05:50 am: |
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Take the bottom off the camera and have a look at the wind interlock under there. There maybe a latch out of place.
How do you set it to B? Good question. With the shutter retard timer removed I think it defaults to B, but try it without the speed ring and see what happens. |
Pcollins
Tinkerer
Username: Pcollins
Post Number: 4
Registered: 10-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 01:22 pm: |
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Slowly making progress with the camera.
I have removed the bottom and noticed that when I had earlier removed the top of the camera I had accidentally pushed the rewind lever post down a bit so that the mechanism was out of place. Pushing it back up helped some of the problem but I seem to have the same issue as described in this archived post:
https://kyp.hauslendale.com/classics/forum/messages/13061/10913.html
I have scoured the referenced articles but this is not a case of dousing the shutter blades with lighter fluid. There is something with the mechanism underneath or in the lens set up. It's frustrating because I just don't know how it all works underneath.
Your continued help is very much appreciated. |
Harryrag
Tinkerer
Username: Harryrag
Post Number: 130
Registered: 05-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 01:14 am: |
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If the full cycle of cocking plus release is not complete, because the self-timer mechanism prevents this, it is, of course, not only a matter of cleaning the blades, athough fron your initial description gummed-up aperture blades may have been the only problem there was. You can separate the shutter module from the camera, but do not remove the shutter from its housing as putting it back is not easy at all. Did you really study the K2 in Mick Feuerbacher's camera repair articles section in that (old) link? There is a picture plus description of the isolated shutter seen from underneath. http://feuerbacher.net/photo/frame.html |
Nickon51
Tinkerer
Username: Nickon51
Post Number: 106
Registered: 05-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 05:31 am: |
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If I understand you correctly, you can now wind the advance lever, push the shutter button, wind the lever again, but the shutter does not cock. Is that where you are now? |
Pcollins
Tinkerer
Username: Pcollins
Post Number: 5
Registered: 10-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 10:23 am: |
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Where I'm at now:
Bottom is off
Front of lens is off to just past the cam ring
I can wind the advance lever and press the shutter button there is a gear/lever that moves and clicks but the shutter doesn't open
When I try to wind the advance lever again there is a lever blocking the advance on the bottom of the camera. I can move that out of the way and hold it while I advance but it returns to this state.
I still have the feeling that I screwed something up in the process of testing the camera before taking it apart. Something to do with the self timer and the winding mechanism. The shutter was mostly functional. The aperture was never functional but was open about f11 or thereabouts. So not to dispute what anyone is saying about cleaning it I feel that there is something MUCH more than that. There seem to be levers and gears that are not functioning the way they're supposed to function as a result of something that I have done.
I'm also gradually getting to the point of just putting the camera back together and putting it on the shelf. I don't know enough to solve the problem on my own but would love to get it working. If I can't do it I would love to find somebody nearby (Hamilton, London, KW) who could sort it out for me. |
Scott
Tinkerer
Username: Scott
Post Number: 53
Registered: 07-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 12:36 pm: |
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Here's what I would do next--
Seeing as how you already have the top and bottom cover off, it would be a small matter to go ahead and take the shutter off of the camera body (on the S2, you can simply remove the square panel that the holds the shutter unit, like in one of the photo above, in the previous post). Peel back the vinyl and take out the four screws.
The shutter can then be cocked and released as much as you like, by pushing the cocking and release rings, and then you would know exactly where you problem is (or isn't). Watch how it is cocked before you take off the lens panel.
Putting that panel back on just requires meshing the shutter-release linkage and the cocking rack (which is actually a lot simpler on the Konica S2 than on most Japanese rangefinders of that period). Take a good look at it as you remove the panel, and it is fairly obvious how it works.
From your description, I think the reason the shutter blades are not opening is because it needs a basic shutter blade cleaning (NOT "flooding" or "flushing"), but probably doesn't require any further disassembly. |
Pcollins
Tinkerer
Username: Pcollins
Post Number: 6
Registered: 10-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 01:20 pm: |
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Ok, I guess I'll dig myself deeper here... LOL
I got the camera as a gift so there is no financial loss for me. I love my old(er) cameras and love to have them as more than just a decoration. I use them if they are functioning and would love to have this one functioning.
Here we go with removing the shutter unit and hoping for the best!
I'll keep you posted but if anyone else has any ideas they would also be welcome. |
