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Alfarolf
Tinkerer
Username: Alfarolf
Post Number: 1
Registered: 07-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, July 20, 2009 - 08:04 am: | 
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I would appreciate help on this matter:
got a.m.camera.Who could help me in operating the strange shutter,as I donot understand it.
thanks for help
rolf in Germany |
Msiegel
Tinkerer
Username: Msiegel
Post Number: 123
Registered: 03-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, July 20, 2009 - 01:16 pm: |
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Have a look here:
http://altissa-museum.de/prospekte/0196b992ce0853901/0196b992ce08f7a46/index.htm l
You can click the pictures to get them enlarged.
The third page of that catalogue describes it in German. "Spannen des Verschlusses und Filmtransport werden wie bei allen Typen der Werra Reihe durch Drehen des breiten gummierten Ringes der sich unmittelbar am Kameragehäuse befindet, vorgenommen"
Martin, Austria
In English roughly: "Cocking of the shutter and transporting the film is, as with all types of the Werra Series, done using the broad rubberized ring which is located directly on the camera body." |
Aford
Tinkerer
Username: Aford
Post Number: 64
Registered: 03-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, July 20, 2009 - 01:32 pm: |
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Here is another site that shows operating the camera step by step.
http://www.mediajoy.com/en/cla_came/werra/index.html
The shutter blades on these cameras often stick closed together, so check the shutter by removing the back, set the aperture wide open, then pointing the camera towards a window fire the shutter. You should see a circle of light, if not, the shutter blades are stuck and you will need to use lighter fuel on the shutter to free it up.
If you wear glasses beware of the view-finder as this is sharp and will scratch your lens's.
Regards - Alf |
Adrian
Tinkerer
Username: Adrian
Post Number: 255
Registered: 08-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, July 20, 2009 - 03:27 pm: |
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Whatever you do, don't press the shutter release while you are winding on - it will stick down, and jam. It's not a difficult repair, but it's a pain in the backside having to do it.
What you do is hold the camera in one hand, facing away from you, grasp that ring with the other, and turn it anti-clockwise until it stops. It'll feel a bit like reaching round a door and turning the doorknob. It's that simple.
The shutters are a pain to work on - not impossible, but awkward, so hopefully yours' works as Alf says. They're nice cameras if they work. |
Alfarolf
Tinkerer
Username: Alfarolf
Post Number: 2
Registered: 07-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, July 30, 2009 - 09:39 am: |
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hallo Martin,
thanks for your help.
Regards Rolf |
Goblin
Tinkerer
Username: Goblin
Post Number: 3
Registered: 08-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, August 06, 2009 - 05:57 pm: |
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I'm happy to see there are other Werra enthousiasts here 
Here are two other tricks of this excellent camera:
- When removing just the small cap at the end of the main lens cap (the big one), the camera's lens is fully functionnal, but protected (a little bit) from dust and rain
- The main cap can be reversed on the lens, transformed in a nice lens hood
I am surprised about winding with the shutter button pressed. Actually back in the time this feature was advertised as a "manual winder motor". Indeed, I've been trying this and with a bit of training could achieve very interesting speeds. I would say at least 2.5-3fps
Maybe that's ok on a new camera, I guess now these old ladies need a little bit more respect. |
Pheonixprime
Tinkerer
Username: Pheonixprime
Post Number: 4
Registered: 06-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, September 06, 2009 - 07:59 pm: |
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Hi to all
Have strange problem with WERRA Prestor RVS shutter..while turning ring at back of lens to cock shutter I look thru lens(wide open)and see shutter open then close before shutter is fully cocked. Pressing shutter release fires shutter normally. What is causing the shutter to open twice and prematurely expose film/ruining a frame. |
Rick_oleson
Tinkerer
Username: Rick_oleson
Post Number: 978
Registered: 07-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, September 07, 2009 - 08:48 am: |
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Hi Pheonixprime: It is normal for the Prestor shutter to open and close during cocking; there is a second set of blades behind the shutter that are supposed to close during the winding cycle to protect the film. These blades must be sticking. I have a sketch that I can email to you if you like. [email protected] |
Krg
Tinkerer
Username: Krg
Post Number: 4
Registered: 10-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, September 14, 2009 - 01:24 am: |
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A Werra discussion group:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WerraGroup
And my french page:
http://pagesperso-orange.fr/krg/werra/werra.htm |
Porisms
Tinkerer
Username: Porisms
Post Number: 1
Registered: 02-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 06:16 am: |
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I recently bought a Werra I that appears to be in perfect condition. It, however, is suffering from the same problem Pheonixprime was experiencing.
With the back and lens removed I can see that the shutter blades open while cocking the camera. I don't see any second set of blades. My film is being exposed every time I wind the camera. Please help. |
Porisms
Tinkerer
Username: Porisms
Post Number: 2
Registered: 02-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 08:19 am: |
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I have taken the camera apart down to the shutter, and I only see one set of blades. |
Porisms
Tinkerer
Username: Porisms
Post Number: 3
Registered: 02-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 02:34 pm: |
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Also - does anyone know how to access the shutter mechanism itself? I have removed the double-ended blade shutter housing and have removed all visible screws. I can't seem to figure out how to get to the springs and cogs. |
Adrian
Tinkerer
Username: Adrian
Post Number: 283
Registered: 08-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 02:53 am: |
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Can you post a pic of the front and rear of the shutter as you have got to now? I'm trying to remember what it looks like, and failing miserably. If you can do that, I can check my junk bag and try to work out how those came apart... |
Porisms
Tinkerer
Username: Porisms
Post Number: 4
Registered: 02-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 08:47 am: |
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I did figure out how to get into the shutter mechanism, and it's in a state of disrepair. Does anyone have, or can anyone take, some close-up pictures of the internals of the Prestor RVS shutter? |
Adrian
Tinkerer
Username: Adrian
Post Number: 284
Registered: 08-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 09:09 am: |
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Not without taking a good one apart, and I don't plan to do that anytime soon!
What do you mean by "state of disrepair" - did you find the second set of blades? IIRC they are activated by a ring with a hook on it - but I can't remember whether one side of it drives one shutter and one the other, or whether there is a second ring activated by a peg on the first... Sorry, I know I'm not being very helpful, I am trying, honest! |
Porisms
Tinkerer
Username: Porisms
Post Number: 5
Registered: 02-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 10:05 am: |
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I did not find the second shutter blades, and the camera is currently completely disassembled.
The shutter had a few random pieces that had come loose, and I can't figure out where to put them. I realize the chances of finding a diagram, schematic, or just some pictures of the inside are slim, but I thought I'd give it a shot. |
Porisms
Tinkerer
Username: Porisms
Post Number: 6
Registered: 02-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 10:30 am: |
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I'd also really appreciate pictures of the capping shutters. |
Adrian
Tinkerer
Username: Adrian
Post Number: 285
Registered: 08-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 01:11 pm: |
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Right... I've had a rummage through my junk bag, found some bits, and put them back together - hopefully these will help, though it sounds horribly as though someone has been in there before you and left you with a shelf camera.
The back of the shutter should look something like this - this is a later capping shutter with two (I think) blades, in place.
http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww269/gray1721/Cappingshutterinplace.jpg
The rear of the shutter body should look something like this:
http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww269/gray1721/Rearofshutter-1.jpg
Here's the two shutters (capping one sans blades):
http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww269/gray1721/Shutters.jpg
This is the capping shutter assembly on its own - the blades fit on the pins. This is an early one, with five blades. Later ones had two. You should be able to tell which yours was by counting the pins on the activating ring - I suspect that you can use the two blades on a five blade ring, but not the other way round as three pins were omitted on the two blade models.
Here's the blades - all five of them.
http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww269/gray1721/Cappingblades.jpg
And here's the assembled capping shutter:
http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww269/gray1721/Cappingshutterassembled.jpg
And with the blades closed:
http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww269/gray1721/Cappingshutterassembled2.jpg
Do they help? |
Adrian
Tinkerer
Username: Adrian
Post Number: 286
Registered: 08-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 01:13 pm: |
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And a picture of the stray bits might help me work out where they should go... |
Porisms
Tinkerer
Username: Porisms
Post Number: 7
Registered: 02-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 03:42 pm: |
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Yes, this helps a great deal. Bought this camera on ebay. It looked pristine. I definitely do not have any capping shutters, they were removed. |
Adrian
Tinkerer
Username: Adrian
Post Number: 287
Registered: 08-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 13, 2010 - 04:10 am: |
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Oh dear... bet the seller didn't notice, or know, either...
I can possibly send you a back section and some capping shutter blades, but I don't know what else you might be missing, especially as there are a couple of very tiny springs which will go AWOL at the slightest provocation, and setting all the parts back in the right place is a pain in the backside. I fear that your best bet is to get another one... If it is any help, I wrecked two before I got a good one. They're not the easiest things to work on until you've done a few. |
Porisms
Tinkerer
Username: Porisms
Post Number: 8
Registered: 02-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 13, 2010 - 05:23 am: |
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I have everything except for the blades and a functioning shutter mechanism (what you have after you remove the 180˚ (non-capping) shutter)). I have all of the pieces to that mechanism, and am in the process of trying to get it working. There are a few oddly shaped pieces whose places I am having trouble finding. I'll post some pictures soon of them. |
Adrian
Tinkerer
Username: Adrian
Post Number: 288
Registered: 08-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 13, 2010 - 03:02 pm: |
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If yours should have had a five-blade capping shutter, I can dig out the best five blades from my junkers, and send them your way. If it had a two-blade one, I'm afraid I can't help - except by sending an entire five-bade unit!
I'll keep dropping by, and if I can help with locating things I will. Good luck! |
Ethostech
Tinkerer
Username: Ethostech
Post Number: 149
Registered: 07-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 19, 2010 - 10:01 pm: |
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Here's a little background for the understanding of the contributors to date. The Werra is an exquisite design from early 1960's East Germany and initial models used the West German Synchro-Compur shutter. When political/commercial elements resulted in a supply cut-off, Zeiss Jena designed its own shutter - the RVS which is in fact the most accurate leaf shutter ever made. To all intents and purposes the nominal shutter speeds are in fact just what you get in practice. If you think you can hand-hold a 1/30 exposure - try it with any other leaf shutter and then try it with a Werra RVS - and the difference in picture negative sharpness will stagger you. And too at the top end, the 1/700 sec is stunningly on the ball.
This was achieved by the pseudo rotary motion of the main shutter blades which unlike conventional leaf shutters do not open, come to a dead stop, and then reverse their direction to close. Those who study the design will realise that the shutter of such configuration is bound to open during the cocking action and thus expose the film-plane. Zeiss Jena overcame this by incorporating a second (capping) shutter at the film-plane. The latter would close during the cocking action. and then open immediately afterwards.
Servicing of the Werra shutters can be a little tricky and is not a job for a novice tinkerer - but the main obstacle/difficulty being experienced with this 50 year old camera model is in removing the total lens-block which is in fact held by a slotted ring as on the outside periphery of the rear element. So one has to work through the film-plane to remove it. The capping shutter has to be accessed though the rear of the lens block - hence the need to remove from the camera body.
The slotted ring is of brass and it screws into female aluminium alloy. Two of more than a dozen Werras which I have restored/rebuilt for my "Collection" - ended up as "junkers" because the aforesaid slotted ring was effectively "welded" by galvanic action of the dissimilar metals. I engineered a special tubular key with "tommy-bar" and with a stainless-steel precision-fit crosspiece to fit the ring-slots. I tried trckling a little acetone into the threaded area - and soaking to soften any possible "shellac: locking. And subsequently was driven a fabricate a very precise metal shield-mask to protect other than the slotted ring from a pencil-tip butane torch heat. Howver, nothing but nothing would break the stick of the slotted ring and ultimately the steel tubular key would predictably break away the shoulders of the brass slots.
Of course there may be variations in the strengths of the Zeiss Jena Sumo Wrestlers who assembled the Werras . but regardless I have posted this little note to illustrate that not all things are "doable" with a 50 year old Werra, |
