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Jani Heikkinen
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 01:33 am: | 
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Hi!
A camera repairman I know said that it is possible to repair an old cloth shutter which has become very brittle and stiff. He said it can be made elastic again, but he was unwilling to give me any more advice as he was hoping I'd pay for him to do it. How can this be done? If it is very complicated I'll probably give it to the repairman to do, but if it's relatively easy I think I'll do it because the repairman has such a long waiting time before he can do it. |
David Nebenzahl
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 02:21 pm: |
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Unless there's some kind of magic elixir which can be applied to cloth to rejuvenate and make it supple again (which I doubt), what he probably referring to was replacing the curtains.
I could be wrong about this, but I don't think so. |
Jani Heikkinen
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 09:32 pm: |
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No, he didn't mean replacing the curtains and he said he can repair it as long as it is still intact and not torn apart. I also remember someone having said that the fabric isn't the reason for the brittleness, but the rubbery stuff that the fabric is painted with that makes it opaque. |
Jim Brokaw
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 11:01 pm: |
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IF you understand that the real fix is to replace the curtains, and IF you understand that to 'rejuvenate' the rubberized fabric correctly means accessing and effectively dismantling the shutter, then you might try taking out the shutter, laying out the shutter curtains, and painting the stiff rubberized fabric with a magic elixer like Armor-All or similar. It probably won't work very well, but you can try it.
Since you've got to go all the way into there to do it right anyway, replacing the curtains is the really right way to do this and not much more work, assuming you can get the replacement material, which several sources exist for. I don't mean to really tank your idea, but there are very very few actual camera repairs that can be done by 'just spraying it on...' or 'just flooding it with...' to an intact camera.
Cleaning or lubricating, it really needs to be done to the right parts only, which always means carefully disassembling the camera first... which is most of the fun, along with putting it back together right and then using it... |
Jani Heikkinen
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 11:30 pm: |
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I KNOW how to make new curtains, I was merely trying to FIND OUT about methods of restoring the old shutter curtains. And I do KNOW I have to disassemble the camera anyway to replace certain parts of the shutter mechanism for which I have already made replacement parts. I also didn't mention anything about spraying or flooding. Actually the correct way is to clean all parts of the shutter and to use specific lubricants to specific places which are documented in repair manuals, but I was not asking about this. |
Ed
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 02:14 pm: |
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forget it and make new ones. never heard of any method of repairing dried out ones. Sometimes in this forum people will try to give advise even if not specifically asked for in an effort to be helpful--it is best take this advise and not try to impress them with your knowledge. |
Jani Heikkinen
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 10:16 pm: |
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The repairman who told about this method has been repairing cameras longer then most of us have been alive, so I think he knows exactly what he is talking about. I'll just be waiting if someone knows about the method. I know I probably should have put this question under restoration and not maintenance and repair.
I'm sorry, I was not trying to impress anyone, just trying to clear out some misunderstandings. |
Jim Brokaw
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 11:32 pm: |
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I should apologize for the 'tone' of my response. I meant to say that I have never heard of any way to rejuvenate shutter curtains, and that it is my belief that in order to do it you are so close to complete disassembly anyway that you should just replace them instead. But I didn't mean to disparage your knowledge or that of the repairman, most of what I know I learned -here-, and I'm still learning. Its a lot of work to get in there are replace the bits, but sometimes that ends up being the only way. For me, I actually enjoy the mechanics of fixing, maybe as much as actually taking the pictures when its finally all done... |
Jani Heikkinen
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 08, 2004 - 12:07 am: |
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It's ok.  Thanks for your help. I like fixing very much too, just like you. At least trying to restore the old curtains would be a new experince for me so that's why I'm so interested of doing it that way. |
Ed
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 09, 2004 - 06:51 am: |
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From my experience, the part of the curtain that ages is the "rubber" coating on one side of the fabric. The cloth itself stays fine usually. Any attempt to "repair" this coating would be, as Jim says, a major deal. Anything that is put on the cloth does, of course, have to completely dry. Otherwise there is the possibility of the material sticking together and causing major shutter problems--irratic speeds, etc. It would be much simpler to replace them. As stated before, I have never heard of a curtain "fix". |
FallisPhoto
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 10, 2004 - 08:55 pm: |
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It may be possible. There may be some chemical out there that will dissolve the coating so you can recoat the curtain. The question is, even if you could do that, why would you want to? The recoated curtain wouldn't be as good a repair as a new one. |
Jani Heikkinen
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 10, 2004 - 10:42 pm: |
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It's because of the challenge of doing that. This is a hobby for me and I don't care or think about money or time when repairing things, it's just fun for me. If the restoring of the old curtain goes wrong, so what, I'll do the new ones then. I also think that dissolving the old coating is what the repairman had probably in mind, there also seems to be some chemicals available that rejuvenate old rubber. |
philip
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 12:10 pm: |
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old crazy idea from the graflex forum -- someone said he'd taken an old, dried out speed graphic shutter curtain and rubbed automotive brake fluid on the rubberized side of the cloth, let it dry out, and remounted it in the camera. Said it became smooth & supple again (maybe it redissolved the rubber?)! Your milage may vary, natch. I've got a speed where the shutter curtain is very crackly -- I've been meaning to pull it and try this on it (not much to loose, eh?).
-- pw |
Jani Heikkinen
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 - 02:18 am: |
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I read the same thing in the cameramakers list and the break fluid truly seems to work. You are right there's not much to loose |
Kevin Jesequel
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2004 - 03:22 pm: |
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Jani,
I don't know if you're still tracking this post, but I may have the answer. Way back when I was in high school I took a graphic arts/printing class. We had a chemical called "rubber rejuvinator" (obvious, huh?) that we applied to the rubber rollers on the printing press. It was fast drying, non-residual and kept the rollers from drying out. I'm sure that you could find it anywhere that sells supplies for offset printing presses. I would imagine that the brake fluid would leave a residue that would be nearly impossible to completely remove and may evaporate and stick to other parts of the camera if left in the heat. |
Jani Heikkinen
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2004 - 10:15 pm: |
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Hi
Thanks for your information. I have also heard of this rubber rejuvenator, I just haven't been able to find it where I live. A guy I know who works in the "plastic" industry told me that these chemicals would probably help only temporarily and after a while the rubber would start to get stiff again and also do it faster, but he was just guessing. It seems that brakefluid has some substance to prevent rubber seals (O-rings) etc. from drying over time as it would mean trouble if the fluid would leak out.
The uppermost curtain of my camera revealed to be so torn next to it's metal rims that I must replace it anyway. However just for trying it out I soaked it in acethone for couple of ours and all the rubber came off and voila it wasn't stiff anylonger and I could have painted it if it had been intact. I still haven't decided what to do with the lower curtain |
Nick Clarke
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, August 28, 2004 - 05:36 am: |
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Quick warning regarding this 'rubber rejuvenator' - if it is the same as the chemicals that used to be used to rejuvenate rubber litho press transfer mats - health & safety have banned this as there have been several cases where excessive use has allowed fumes to affect contact lenses worn by users - they partially melt and become stuck! I have had to throw out a litho machine as it is too expensive to replace belts which are in need of rejuvenation! |
Jani Heikkinen
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, August 28, 2004 - 09:15 am: |
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It seems that from what I've read from this list and heard elsewhere, that the rejuvenation of rubber isn't permanent but instead may even speed it up after helping out for a small amount of time. So I didn't use rejuvenation, but instead replace those curtains that are badly torn and remove old rubber and repaint from those that have the fabric intact.
Thank you for all your help. |
