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Tim_witt
Tinkerer
Username: Tim_witt
Post Number: 10
Registered: 02-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 20, 2010 - 12:16 pm: | 
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I have good battery, clean battery contact, clean battery holder, good solder joint on battery holder, looks like there's never been a battery leak. What are the most likely causes of a dead meter in the F-1n? Light does not move the needle, battery check does not move the needle. The shutter speed knob moves the needle and the aperture ring moves the circle on a stick. Time to remove the top.
Also the advance lever is not catching to advance the film until very late in the stroke, requiring two partial strokes to get a full frame advance. There is no spring return from the end of the stroke or anywhere in between. The advance lever must be manually returned to the pushed in or resting position. Same action with or without film. Sometimes the frame counter will advance but the film does not. This happens only if you stop winding at the first catch point which is always too near the end of the stroke, thus requiring two strokes for a complete frame advance. Time to remove the top.
The camera works fine otherwise, I shot one roll 1/30 through 1/2000 and film looks fine.
Any ideas? What speed and ASA to set or any other cautions before removing the top? |
Tim_witt
Tinkerer
Username: Tim_witt
Post Number: 11
Registered: 02-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 20, 2010 - 02:44 pm: |
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This is the second model, also called improved F-1 (1976), not the final version with the 6 volt battery. |
Gez
Tinkerer
Username: Gez
Post Number: 180
Registered: 09-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 20, 2010 - 05:22 pm: |
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It appears you will have to remove both side plates, it's a bit tricky. Check if your local library has back issues of The Camera Craftsman magazine, the November 1974 issue has a full 30 page strip-down report of the original F-1. |
David_nebenzahl
Tinkerer
Username: David_nebenzahl
Post Number: 170
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 20, 2010 - 05:32 pm: |
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A library with back issues (to the 1970s) of The Camera Craftsman??? Tell me where--I want to move there!
(My way of saying "you ain't going to find it there".) |
Tim_witt
Tinkerer
Username: Tim_witt
Post Number: 12
Registered: 02-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 20, 2010 - 06:49 pm: |
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I live in quite a rural area in Virginia and have seen everything the county library has. No magazines, but I bought the Ansel Adams book series that had been removed from the shelf.
My biggest concern on top removal is where to set the ASA and shutter speed, if necessary, like some other cameras require. I have a PDF manual, it has an exploded view but it does not have any details on top removal. |
David_nebenzahl
Tinkerer
Username: David_nebenzahl
Post Number: 171
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 20, 2010 - 07:08 pm: |
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Well, after my admittedly dismissive comment, that article would be quite valuable if you could get your hands on it. Wonder if anyone's scanned it, or if it's in some (paper) archive somewhere? |
Tim_witt
Tinkerer
Username: Tim_witt
Post Number: 13
Registered: 02-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 20, 2010 - 07:52 pm: |
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I've looked at over one hundred Google hits and found nothing helpful. |
Gez
Tinkerer
Username: Gez
Post Number: 181
Registered: 09-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 21, 2010 - 03:51 am: |
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The knob is set to 1/2000 & 25asa, but there are a few other things to watch out for. Send me a PM and I'll scan a couple of pages to get you started. |
Tim_witt
Tinkerer
Username: Tim_witt
Post Number: 14
Registered: 02-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 22, 2010 - 02:00 pm: |
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With the left top cover off and using a VOM, found oxidized switch contacts for both battery test and meter positions. Zero potential, all due to black oxidation. Cleaned contacts and it went form zero to full battery voltage. Meter still will not move.
On my FTb with the switch off, the meter does not move when the shutter speed knob is rotated. On this F-1, the meter DOES move in same circumstances. This makes me think the meter needle is stuck in it's piviots and the needle moves with the meter unit anytime the linkage turns the whole meter unit. |
Aphototaker
Tinkerer
Username: Aphototaker
Post Number: 77
Registered: 12-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 22, 2010 - 11:12 pm: |
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Does the needle move at all shutter speeds (from 1/1 to 1/1000) while the switch is off?
What happens if you point the camera toward a bright light source (open window, desk lamp, etc.) at t=1/4 and a=1.8 and switch on the meter? Do you see any deflection of the needle?
You do realize that the meter needle moves at with shutter speeds at slower speeds (1/8 to 1/4 I think)? This is different than a deflection of the needle when measure light.
Aren't there two metal strips just below the meter switch that get connected when you do a battery check? I am not familiar with an F-1, but that is how it is in FTb. If yes, then verify those contacts are clean.
That intermittent movement of meter needle (is it a deflection? The two are different) may also mean dirty contacts and/or obstructed needle. I am no camera repair guru, but the former looks more likely.
Hang in there. You are making progress. |
Tim_witt
Tinkerer
Username: Tim_witt
Post Number: 15
Registered: 02-2008
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 23, 2010 - 03:02 pm: |
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I know the needle should at some point track with the shutter knob because of the meter housing coupling to the shutter speed knob but this needle moves with every click of the shutter dial until the needle reaches a firm stop at the top or bottom of the scale. When the needle touches either firm stop, there are two speeds left. When the knob is turned these two clicks, the needle is pressed against either firm stop and the meter housing will continue to turn these last two clicks. This repositions the needle (deflection via pressing needle against hard stop) by two (speed)stops and the needle does not spring return to any point. Turning the speed dial the opposite way does the same thing just one way the speed knob is increasing and the other way it is decreasing.
First defect found was oxidized switch contacts with 1.35 volts on the common of the switch and zero on either the meter position or the meter test position. Cleaning the switch contacts resulted in 1.35 volts available at both switch points. The meter needle never deflects regardless of light level or meter test position. I am convinced the needle is not turning freely in it's jeweled bearings. I can't see these without further disassembly so it's unknown if there is lint, dirt or other crud in the movement. So far, the inside of the camera has been clean. I would not expect any lubricant to have been used on the movement during manufacture. I've identified the wire going to the meter so tomorrow I'll check voltage there and try to examine the needle movement without disassembly of the meter unit.
If I find proper voltage at the meter but no deflection and I find voltage variation with different light levels using a VOM at the meter wire and no deflection, I'll then check the meter coil to see if it is open. If the coil is open then I'll go no further since the meter would be bad. If the coil is not open I'll touch the needle with a probe to see if is moves freely and see if it returns via spring to some resting point. If it does not move freely, I may then spray electrical contact cleaner in the meter movement to see if that helps, nothing to lose if the meter does not move freely in it's bearings anyway. |
