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Cooltouch
Tinkerer
Username: Cooltouch
Post Number: 243
Registered: 01-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 06, 2013 - 01:07 pm: | 
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Recently I picked up the subject camera for a song at a local thrift store. It's in pretty nice shape, except the shutter is badly in need of a CLA. Well, as it so happens, I have another camera with a Synchro Compur, an Agfa Isolette III, that's also in need of a shutter CLA, so I've decided it's time to bite the bullet and "earn my wings," so to speak, and dismantle one of these bewilderingly complex shutters. Hopefully, with a bit of luck and some good repair technique I'll be able to "remantle" it once I've finished giving its parts a bath.
First off, I'd like to thank Dan Mitchell for his page on showing the dismantling of the Compur Rapid shutter at his website, which turns out to be very similar to my Synchro Compur, and to Hans Kerensky for his photos at Flickr of the disassembly of a Synchro Compur from an Agfa Isolette that happens to be identical to my Ikonta's shutter -- but different from MY Isolette's shutter. Go figure. 
I've just begun the disassembly process, but in my typical bull-headed fashion, I tried to do it without any aids, and managed to have one of the shutter leaves fall out while the shutter was still fully assembled (I'd just finished removing the lens cells and was prying on something I shouldn't have, obviously). And of course as soon as one leaf fell out, a couple more followed right behind, so I went ahead and gently removed the rest. So now I must disassemble the shutter to the point where I can reset the shutter leaves.
My question for those of you who have done this a time or two is this: is it really necessary that I entirely dismantle the shutter to reach the shutter leaves -- or that area where they mount? The interior of this shutter is very clean and I'm thinking I can probably give it a light spritzing here and there to get the speeds back on track, like the star-wheel and palette assembly that Rick refers to. It would sure be nice if I didn't have to completely disassemble this thing. But if I have to, I'm now prepared to proceed at least, armed with info from Dan, Hans, and also a couple of articles from Rick Oleson on the subject.
TIA for any help or advice you care to provide. |
Cooltouch
Tinkerer
Username: Cooltouch
Post Number: 244
Registered: 01-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 06, 2013 - 04:14 pm: |
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Okay, I thought I should update this thread, since I've spent some time with the shutter. As it turns out, apparently the only thing(s) holding the two halves of the shutter together are three screws at the back of the back half -- the cup-shaped half that the other half with all the levers and gears and springs sits into. I wasn't successful prying the two halves apart because the flash sync terminal is a tight press fit into the back half, but since it's screwed down onto the front half, it gave the impression that the shutter assembly was being held together by something, when all it was was the interference fit of the flash sync terminal. And now I see why the shutter leaves fell out. When I removed those three screws from the back half, this released the two halves from each other, so when I went to prying on things, a large enough gap was created so the leaves could fall out.
Repositioning the leaves is somewhat tedious, but with a good set of tweezers, it's not difficult. To make sure they stay put, the two halves need to be pushed together and then held tightly while the three screws are screwed back in place, securing the two halves.
Now that I've dismantled the shutter as far as I needed -- actually farther than I needed, but hey it's good practice -- I don't feel nearly as daunted by the shutter's complexity as I did when I first started this process. The various levers and escapements all sort of interlock with each other and cleaning them all is quite simple. I dunked the individual pieces that I removed in naphtha. (I don't use lighter fluid -- too expensive. I buy a quart can of naphtha at the hardware store for about $6. A lifetime supply.) I left the slow speed escapement attached to the base plate and just dunked the whole thing, then spritzed the individual gears with a syringe loaded with naphtha. Everything spins fine now. I don't see how it hurts anything dunking the whole assembly once the glass has been removed. The only non-metallic component is a small bit of fiber material around the flash sync terminal, and it wasn't affected by the naphtha. Everything else is metal -- steel, brass, or aluminum -- and isn't gonna be hurt by getting dunked.
Right now, I'm reassembling everything. I've just reset the shutter leaves and secured the back half. I don't foresee any difficulties, with the possible exception of one spring that sort of appeared out of nowhere. I haven't figured out yet where it's supposed to go. I guess if I get stumped by that spring, I'll be posting another note here, asking for help. |
Br1078lum
Tinkerer
Username: Br1078lum
Post Number: 522
Registered: 11-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 06, 2013 - 08:15 pm: |
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You could have saved yourself a lot of trouble by removing the escapement and delay, and just cleaning them. As long as there is no oil or grease on the shutter blades, they are usually best left alone. Then you can adjust the 1 second speed when putting things back.
The Synchro-Compur is not one of my favorite shutters to work on, as usually there is no way to hold the cocking rack in place when dry-firing the shutter with the speed cam removed. Every once in a while you find a design that lets you put the cover retaining ring back on after taking the cover off, and this will hold things together.
PF |
Cooltouch
Tinkerer
Username: Cooltouch
Post Number: 245
Registered: 01-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 06, 2013 - 10:58 pm: |
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Yeah, I realize I could have saved myself a lot of grief if I'd only known then what I do now. *sigh* Live and learn, eh?
I'm not at all sure yet what a "cocking rack" is or a "speed cam" for that matter, but I know what you mean. The circular doodad with a lot of odd projections here and there and with the cocking lever -- is that the cocking rack? Yeah, there are about four or five spring-loaded levers and such that have to be moved out of the way just to get it to sit down the way it's supposed to. And it's not much fun trying to charge the shutter while holding it in place and making sure one of those levers doesn't slip under it. I found that if I went ahead and installed the speed selector ring -- is that your "speed cam"? -- just pushing it into place, that this kept the cocking ring put and I could try dry-firing the shutter. Which is when I discovered that I must not have put everything back exactly right.
I did my best re-installing everything using Hans's photos as a guide, and I felt pretty good that I'd done everything correctly. But obviously I haven't. For starters, the shutter release doesn't do anything. Sometimes -- it seems to depend on the shutter speed I select -- the shutter will fire as soon as I let go of the cocking lever. Other times I have to give it bit of shove to get things going. Other times it just locks up solid and I have to remove the shutter speed selector dial and fiddle around with it to get things to release.
Actually, getting the shutter blades back in place and working correctly was the easiest part of this whole ordeal. A bit tedious, but nothing at all tricky about getting them back into place.
The most frustrating part of this whole process has been dealing with the springs. I hate springs. I hate them because sooner or later one is gonna vanish. And this shutter didn't let me down in that regard. The tiny spring that acts to keep the MX lever firmly in the X position, which is about a half inch long and as thick as a human hair (actually probably about 0.012") simply vanished as I was reinstalling it. There are no other words to describe its behavior. One second it was there and the next it had just disappeared. Not a blur, not even the slightest sound of it impacting against anything. It's just gone. I tried fabricating a replacement from a section of a 0.013" guitar string, but found out after shaping it that it was just a tad too thick. I have both a 0.010" and a 0.012" string and I'll try again tomorrow. One of the two should work. But if things don't work out, I won't be too upset. The MX selector still stays in the X position, it just doesn't snap into that position without the spring.
Tomorrow I plan to dismantle the shutter again and see if I can spot anything that looks different from the first time I dismantled it. If I can spot something like this, then chances are, that'll be the culprit. It's times like these that I wish the camera repair class I took many years ago still existed. I could sure use the insights and wisdom of that curmudgeonly old instructor right about now. |
Hanskerensky
Tinkerer
Username: Hanskerensky
Post Number: 243
Registered: 05-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, April 07, 2013 - 03:00 am: |
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Ahh, bad luck with that spring !
As PF wrote before the Synchro-Compur is not one of the easiest shutters.
One thing that i have learned is that you cannot do these kinds of work in a rush unless you're a professional who does these jobs on a daily basis.
With springs you have to be extremely cautious. I sometimes spend hours just to find a method of re-installing one ! |
Cooltouch
Tinkerer
Username: Cooltouch
Post Number: 247
Registered: 01-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, April 07, 2013 - 08:35 am: |
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Hey Hans! Well, that must be my problem then. I didn't spend the requisite amount of time with that tiny spring, getting to know it more intimately. I'll have my chance to make up for it, though, when I make a replacement. It took almost an hour to shape the 0.013" one. Seems like a lot of time for a 1/2" long piece with a couple of kinks and curves, but that's probably because I had to use a couple of pairs of needle nose pliers to make it.
I'm at least partially to blame for my predicament regarding getting stuck with a Synchro Compur shutter. In older, German-made cameras, I kinda insist on the S-C when I purchase a folder, because it has flash sync. Besides, I think the SC shutters just look a lot cooler than the Compur Rapids.
I agree about not rushing things. In fact, with this shutter, I made a point of waiting until I was in the right frame of mind before tackling the job. *sigh* A lot of good it did. Now I get to do it all over again. But I'm finding that psyching myself up for the second time is easier because I don't feel nearly as intimidated. Except for the springs. Springs still get to me. |
Cooltouch
Tinkerer
Username: Cooltouch
Post Number: 250
Registered: 01-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, April 07, 2013 - 09:23 am: |
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Oh, I forgot to ask. Are there any spots on this shutter that would benefit from a bit of lubrication? I have some very fine machine oil in a syringe-like applicator that I can use to get it precisely where it should go. I just need to know where that is. The slow-speed escapement, perhaps?
Or should I just leave it dry -- the way it is now? |
Br1078lum
Tinkerer
Username: Br1078lum
Post Number: 524
Registered: 11-2010
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, April 07, 2013 - 08:12 pm: |
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Get you a strong magnet, and drag it around under your work area. You'll be amazed at what comes up.
PF |
Cooltouch
Tinkerer
Username: Cooltouch
Post Number: 251
Registered: 01-2009
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 08, 2013 - 07:47 am: |
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I have a rare earth magnet about the size of a quarter that I use for this, and yes, I've found tiny lost screws this way. And yes, I tried the magnet where I lost this spring, but no luck so far.
A camera tech I used to know years ago was the one who told me first about this trick. He said that he had a larger horseshoe-shaped magnet tied on a string that he slung around on the floor to pick up tiny screws and what have you. I like his method better than mine -- I don't have anything to attach the string to, so I just end up pushing the magnet around with my foot. |
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